Blink menu after open

Poster: Copc
Dated: Tuesday December 27 2005 - 12:40:15 GMT

Sorry, I know English very bad.
I study Milonic Menu. It’s great product. But has problem.
1. I save to disk any sample.
2. Open "index.html"
...
3. Browser load text content of page, but menu appears late!
This very bad!
Goal: text content and menu appears simultaneously!
It’s possible???

menu Version 5.738

Poster: Migru
Dated: Tuesday December 27 2005 - 19:12:28 GMT

HI

the menu system is most probably the best, you can find.
But please, coming to your question, what type of support do you expect with this question ?
There are many samples to download and they should work as expected, in the same way as they do from their original website.
They are documented very well and relevant files have to be studied, certain rules have to be followed, in order to install the system. Help links and menu references are listed as follows.

Michael
_________________
Help links :
Beginner
http://www.milonic.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=14
http://www.milonic.com/tablemenu.php
Menu Reference
http://www.milonic.com/styleproperties.php
http://www.milonic.com/menuproperties.php
http://www.milonic.com/itemproperties.php

Re: menu Version 5.738

Poster: Copc
Dated: Tuesday December 27 2005 - 22:29:23 GMT

[quote="Migru"]the menu system is most probably the best, you can find.[/quote]
True.
[quote="Migru"]But please, coming to your question, what type of support do you expect with this question ?[/quote]
I want solve my problem. You can help me?:)
[quote="Migru"]There are many samples to download and they should work as expected, in the same way as they do from their original website.
They are documented very well and relevant files have to be studied, certain rules have to be followed, in order to install the system. Help links and menu references are listed as follows.[/quote]
Thanks.

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Tuesday December 27 2005 - 23:38:03 GMT

Hi Copc,

The problem is, we don't really know the problem unless you can put up the page as a test page so we can see what is happening.

If you are saying you want everything on the page to appear at the same time, that's dependent on the browser, the connection of the visitor, the content of the page. I don't know any way to tell a browser...... dont' load anything until you have everything in the cache and can pop it all on the page at once. I don't really know any way to tell a browser, load this first, this next and so on.

If you are putting things, including the menu in a table, table content will not show until all the content of the table has been read.

So, can you give us a test page so we can see what's going on?

Ruth

Poster: Copc
Dated: Thursday December 29 2005 - 23:53:56 GMT

2Ruth:

>The problem is, we don't really know the problem unless you can put up the
>page as a test page so we can see what is happening.

This not need. Save any sample to your disk, open index.html and pres F5.
Sequence:
- In first moment browser show page content _without_ menu.
- In second moment appears menu.
True???
I testing in IE 6.0, Opera 8.5 and FireFox 1.5.

>If you are saying you want everything on the page to appear at the same time,
>that's dependent on the browser, the connection of the visitor, the content of the
>page. I don't know any way to tell a browser...... dont' load anything until you
>have everything in the cache and can pop it all on the page at once. I don't really
>know any way to tell a browser, load this first, this next and so on.

I understand this.
IMFO, problem in menu technology.
I think sequence action:
- Browser load html file and show content.
- Human see page _without_ menu!
- Browser run menu script.
- Script create HTML objects for menu.
- Menu appears.
- Human see page _with_ menu.
Menu blink in process of page load. In ANY sample.
I don’s know universal decision.
Offer:
Create any tools. This tools must generate _first_ level of menu in html-file. User insert this file in own html document. In this case menu and page content appears simultaneously. But this not comfortable. But user (page developer) has choice!

You understand me?

Poster: Copc
Dated: Thursday December 29 2005 - 23:59:30 GMT

Probably you have problems when read my posts. Thanks for your answers:)

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Friday December 30 2005 - 0:39:41 GMT

I really don't know of anyway to do what you want. There is a list based menu you can see a sort of demo here. The listbased menu is included in the download. http://www.milonic.com/listbased/

I don't know how you would do what you want about having some kind of html file that would have all the menu info, it's a dhtml menu using javascript. If it could be html then it's just something anyone can do on their page. There are php and asp mysql menus, I've seen users who use dom models in creating the menu. I dont' know if any of that is what you want.

You could also do some kind of javascript layer which has a message about waiting for the page to load or an image or a welcome or something that would then disappear after the page loads. I don't know any javascript so I have no idea how to do that, but I know it has been done.

I understand what you are saying, the problem may be that I don't know enough about javascript, programming, webpages and such to answer the question. When I load the download sample and hit F5 everything on the page loads at the same time. IE5.5.

Ruth

The problem with the problems

Poster: Migru
Dated: Friday December 30 2005 - 1:35:42 GMT

Hi to everyone,

I try to understand, but it might be a problem at your side only, maybe a slow system, slow connection , slow performance ?

I am using e.g. a fast DSL connection. The question if the performance of the menu system matches the speed of browser-html and if any delay can be observed between the loading of html and interpreting of scripts is not of any real importance for the standard user and standard pages, as script files normally are located almost on top of a page. Discussions on this cannot be main issue of this forum. For that issue I would like to recommend a forum which is offered by the browser - programmers, like Opera or FireFox etc., or maybe even Microsoft or by webdesigners, as the overall performance depends on so many different issues, loading of images e.g. video files, animated files etc. etc.

Regards
Michael

Re: The problem with the problems

Poster: Copc
Dated: Friday December 30 2005 - 23:20:11 GMT


Slow connection??? I load menu from _local_ disk:))) Slow performance? My computer: 2.4 GHz, 256MB, WinXP SP2 Bowsers: IE 6.0, Opera 8.5, FF 1.5...

Poster: Copc
Dated: Friday December 30 2005 - 23:28:32 GMT


How version you try? I try demo version. Demo version (how I think) scan html-page for find anchor (<A>) to Milonic. Maybe it scan - cause of delay?

I can pay many. No problem. But... delay for show menu...

In this moment I think cause of dalay in this:
- Browser load page and show page.
- In next moment browser run scripts.

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 0:08:46 GMT

Did you download a sample? Which one?

Ruth

Poster: Copc
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 1:44:32 GMT


I download very many samples!

I (with special tool) save video file - from my screen. In video I repeatedly press F5. I use sample from Milonic site (menu_sample2_ver5_738.zip) and FF 1.5. Menu blink, text on page not blink.

I can send video file (1,80 MB) and samle code with email. Send?

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 2:18:32 GMT

Hi,

Is there someplace you can put the video on the web for me to download?

Ruth

Poster: Copc
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 2:43:14 GMT


http://petrakovskijAV.narod.ru/2.avi
http://petrakovskijAV.narod.ru/Video.zip
I slightly edit menu_data.js.

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 6:39:52 GMT

Take out the overflow="scroll"; from the main menu.

Ruth

Poster: Copc
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 12:02:42 GMT


Not help:(
In your Fire Fox You have blink effect? In your Opera?

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Saturday December 31 2005 - 13:07:18 GMT

It has to do with it being on the desktop. I put it on the web and the whole page reloads/refreshes as any page does with everything going blank, the status bar saying contacting or retrieving data from www. whatever

I tried it in FF, IE, NN and Opera, they all do the same thing. There is no text that remains while the menu disappears and reappears, everything disappears and the page loads again.

http://support.milonic.com/ruth/index.htm

Let me know when you see this so I can remove the page.

Ruth

Poster: Copc
Dated: Sunday January 1 2006 - 14:12:45 GMT


Dont understand:( You want say: menu blink only from local disk, from web not blink?

Your page I see.

Poster: Ruth
Dated: Sunday January 1 2006 - 15:49:15 GMT

That is your page from the zip file. I put it on the web. It does not blink on the web when you hit F5.

on local disk it does look like it blinks, but if you hold F5 a second it does not blink it refreshes the whole page. The menu does not blink. This is a browser local disk issue, not the menu.

Ruth

Poster: kevin3442
Dated: Wednesday January 4 2006 - 3:56:09 GMT

Hi All,

If I might add to the discussion...

I do not think that Copc means "blink" in the sense that the menu appears, disappears, then reappears. I think he is referring to the fact that the content of the sample page appears before the menu appears, so that there is a noticable delay between when the textual content of the page appears and when the main menu appears, even when loading a sample from the hard disk. In this case, it is not the loading time that is at work, but the processing time that makes the difference.

Any browser loads the elements on a page sequentially, processing from top to bottom. Even if the menu scripts are loaded at the top of the document, and processing of the code therefore begins before other content is loaded further down the page, some of the body's content may still appear before the menu. This would be particularly true of simple text in the document's body. Simple text does not have to be "built" and will therefore be rendered very quickly by the browser. But the menu is a set of complex data structures and function, even if it is only composed of textual elements; it takes time to build the menu structures from the menu_data code, process them, and render the main menu(s). Therefore, it is only natural that the menu might appear after the browser has already received the html code for the simpler or smaller elements in the page. It depends a lot on the elements themselves, both in the menu and on the page. For example, if the page includes a text-only menu along with an <img> tag to load a .jpg image that is 1.5 MB in size, then the menu will most likely appear before that image does (at least the first time the image is served over the web, even over a fast connection). Of course, it also depends on the elements within the menu; a text-based menu will appear sooner than an image-based menu, especially if the menu's images are large. A simple menu, with few levels, will process faster than a comples menu, with many levels and many items in each submenu. This makes sense.

The delay between the content appearing and the menu appearing when loading one of the samples from a hard disk is noticable, but is very slight (certainly less than a second). Most of the body content in the samples is plain text in a very simple table structure. It requires a negligible amount of processing to render that content. Yet even for the simplest of text-based main menus, the menu scripts must still be processed. This takes time. So, it is reasonable to expect the slight delay that we are calling a "blink."

The only possible remedy that I can see is to manually construct a main "menu" composed of static html elements, like <a> links or <img> tags, and use each element's onmouseover attribute to call the menu's popup() function to open a corresponding Milonic submenu. In this way, since the main "menu" is not a Milonic menu, but is instead simple html elements, it should appear in the normal top-down processing of the page, along with the other simple elements in the body. Many users have taken this approach, and there are a few samples in the site that demonstrate how to do it.

Hope that helps,

Kevin